back to BUILDING A TEAM
fil here, cutting in line 1-22
Snapshots
Here is a comparitive chart:
10th level snapshot
| celestine | sul(as ghost) | tanner | Vintereth | Valeas |
| melee to hit | +14/+9 | +9 | +7 | +21 | +19 |
| ranged to hit | +6/+1 | +8 | +5 | +17 | +13 |
| # of attacks(usually) | 2 | sword or warshaper... | 2 | 7 | 4 |
| damage/attack(usually) | hellfire blast: 8d6 (1/round) -or- Jade: 1d6+11 (2/round) | 1d8 or warshaper | 1d6 or magic | 1d6+16 or 1dX+11 | 1d6+16 |
| ac | 24 | 28 | 28 | 29 | 30 |
| touch ac | 17 | 20 | 28 | 15 | 25 |
| flatfooted | 23 | 28 | 28 | 19 | 26 |
| flfoot touch ac | 16 | 20 | 28 | 10 | 15 |
| hit points | 63 | 67 | 82 | 83 | 105 |
| saves f/r/w | 11/4/11 | 14/16/21+mettle | 17/15/21 | 14/11/11 | 12/12/11 |
| cast level | 10th | | 15th | 10th (when using arcane focus) | |
| spell penetration | - | | ? | | |
| move style+speeds | land 30 ft/fly 30 ft (w/warlock invocation). fly 60 ft w/druid spell | 30' fly (perfect) | 30 & 240' via ethereal mount | 25' (faster with speed burst) | land 50 |
| raw stats | STR 8, DEX 8, CON 14, INT 16, WIS 16, CHA 16 | | STR 10, DEX 11, CON 8, INT 16, WIS 10, CHA 24 | STR 14, DEX 16, CON 14, INT 16, WIS 10, CHA 10 | STR 25, DEX 16, CON 18, INT 13, WIS 16, CHA 8 |
| stats modified | STR 29, DEX 13, CON 14, INT 16, WIS 19, CHA 19 | Str 6, Dex 10, Con -, Int 18, Wis 16, Cha 30 | STR 10, DEX 11, CON 8, INT 18, WIS 10, CHA 34 | STR 14, DEX 20, CON 16, INT 22, WIS 12, CHA 10 | STR 28, DEX 18, CON 20, INT 13, WIS 16, CHA 8 |
| hide | +1 | 24* | +12 (Marshall Aura) | +18 | +26 |
| move siilenty | +1 | 4* | +12 (Marshall Aura) | +18 | +26 |
| spot | +4 | 14 | +0 & 80' blindsense via Dragonsight | +1 | +18 |
| listen | +4 | 14 | +0 | +1 | +18 |
| bluff | +4 | 21 | +25 | +15 -> +73 if properly buffed | -1 |
| diplomacy | +4 | 18 | +37 | +17 | -1 |
| sense motive | +4 | 15 | +5 | +14 | +3 |
| tumble | - | 5 | - | +10 | +16 |
| immunities | - | undead | - | poison, stunning, critical hits, sneak attacks | fear |
| typical buffs | Entropic Warding and See the Unseen are always up | detect thoughts, host body | Familiar Pocket, Unseen Servant, Divine Insight, Ethereal Mount, Greater Mage Armor, Dragonsight - more if warned | Anticipate Teleportation, Greater Magic Weapon, Delay Poison, Explosive Runes | Haste(from boots), Bless(from Weapon) |
| bonuses from buffs | Darkvision 60 feet, see invisible creatures, entropic shield effect, pass without trace effect, cannot be tracked by scent | bonus to AC and attack on anyone I'm reading | +6 AC (included above) | Weapon->+2 (above) | |
anything else I missed?Before adventuring will buff up more with 24 hour flight, possibly invisibility, and druid buffs*N/A in material world, or different usageVery Flexible Casting, 22+spell level DCsSwift Expeditious Retreat 6/dayFast Healing 4|
DavidWL
I'd like us to have a chance to compare each of our builds (both now and in the future). I've made some estimations when I didn't know something. Also, this is mostly comparisons without buffs ... things could certainly change a lot as different possessed bodies/wildshaped forms/buff sequences/spells are choosen. I'd like people to edit the evaluations of their own builds for greater accuracy.
Here are a few things we can compare on (suggestions very welcome):
- Survivability (ability to avoid nasty things) & HP survivability / AC (including evasion, DR, etc.)
- Combat utility
- Out of Combat utility
10th level Builds:
Survivability
- Estimated: 13/8/8 Saves, 28 AC, ~80 HP. Lots of Akashic/Chameleon Trickery
- 17/15/21 + reroll 1s for Saves, 28 AC (including touch and flatfooted), 82 HP
- 14/16/21 + Mettle for Saves, Incorporeal, Rejuvenation, AC 28, 181 HP (one tough mother)
- ZarZak - Planar Shepherd Warlock - snapshot in main page
- 11/4/11 Saves, ~63 HP, 24 AC; 23 flatfoot, 17 touch
- 12/12/11 Saves, ~105HP, Evasion, AC30
...
DavidWL -
Surreal is one tough mother. I'm doing pretty good. I'd say: Surreal > DavidWL > NoldorForce > Dhraksis = ZarZak
Although part of the reason I'm putting ZarZak towards the bottom is that it looks like he intends to be in the thick of things with a Werebear from. So, my summary: Surreal is definitely too tough to really hurt unless it can attack him directly. I may be a little too tough. ZarZak needs beefing up if he plans to be in the thick of things (buff sequence?).
^^- ZarZak - Celestine, with his wonderful warlock abilities, can and probably will spend all day flying around shooting ridiculous eldtrich rays and spells at people. The werebear form just happened to be a good one for this level as it gives big stat boosts and is a humanoid form. He'll also have some strong battlefield control utility.
^^Surreal - Sul is indeed very difficult to hurt, moreso if I have a strong host body to inhabit, in which case it's almost impossible to do damage to me directly. However, I do have other limitation (see below). My ability to actually deal damage is also highly dependant on what bodies I am able to inhabit; otherwise I sit squarely in the role of disabler.
^^Noldor - At this point, Vintereth will probably buff-and-switch, preferably with stuff Extended by a rod. That AC will probably be increased in a few ways. And at 12th level, weirder stuff will happen (see below).
Combat utility
Please flesh out some stats for each of your builds:
- At the moment, just a many-hit fighter type. At later levels, this will change.
- Nasty Spellcasting (many choices, DCs = 22+lvl, CL=15)
- combat involves a couple options:
a) possessing whatever is the biggest melee threat (and/or whoever has the lowest will save)
b) trying to mentally disable my opponents (daze, confuse, stun, etc. or outright mindgames)
c) sending in my shadow companion with the negative aura and to do ~6 Str damage (if any of the casters could follow up with a maxed out twinned Ray of Enfeeblement or somesuch, that neutralizes a threat pretty quickly)
d) under ideal circumstances (ie: never), I can do all of the above simultaneously
My ability to deal any real combat damage is highly dependant on what kind of bodies I can possess. Otherwise, I sit back in the role of disabler. If all the enemies are immune to my mental tricks, then I suppose I have a couple other options:
e) possess an ally and grant bonuses to stats (+4 Str/Con, +4 to another (can be either Str or Con again)
f) hide, possibly possess an item held by the enemy to sneak away with them after battle (assuming I telepathically tell the team to call a strategic retreat)
- ZarZak - Planar Shepherd Warlock
- Full Druidic casting, Warlock abilities, and Werebear form. 8d6 Hellfire blast each round, + whatever battlefield control spells/invocations are needed. He'll be flying so he'll be able to get a good scope of the field. Probably quite effective
...
- mobile tank with good damage output, tripping ability and good defenses(its very hard to full attack him in melee)
DavidWL -
Looks to me like everyone is good, although as stats get fleshed out we'll see if anyone is particularly overpowering when it comes to laying smackdown on monsters. To some extent this depends on the tricks people intend to use. If we knew stats for the primary trick, that could help (chance to hit, number of attacks, average damage or DCs and CLs, etc.)
Out of Combat utility
Looks to me like everyone is good. Please flesh out some stats for each of your builds:
- Some social skills, bits of trickery with Knowledge skills, and low-SL arcane casting. With time to prepare, spell and feat rerouting can occur. Don't forget item crafting, either. If/when I can get a copy of Lords of Madness (still can't find my original copy), I'll work out something for that mean Elder Eidolon.
- Very flexible spellcasting, Social Monkey with +24-+36 on a few social skill checks
- With an incorporeal changling ghost, he has lots of tricks
- my options here actually aren't that different from my combat options:
a) possess bodies, read thoughts, telepathy, multi-lingual, gather info, I spy with my little eye
b) Changeling Rogue substitution level lets me make quick gather info and social sense motive checks
c) I do NOT have a good trapfinding ability, but as a ghost I can float a through anything and easily scout relatively undetected
d) David/Tanner's Fiend of Possession will have many similar abilities
e) I am not the primary face despite the skills and high Cha; however, in a couple levels I will take a level of Marshall and be able to boost everyone's Cha skills
- ZarZak - Planar Shepherd Warlock
- Full Druidic casting (and later on, Clerical). Out of combat Celestine can open gates to other planes, and do lots of nature-y stuff (the druid spell list is pretty big). He can also sneak around quite well depending on the shape he's in. Some out of combat tricks, but not so many?
...
- highly effective scout, limited tracking ability
DavidWL -
My thought is that I don't know what role Dhraksis wants to play out of combat. I think that NoldorForce and Surreal make for great sneaks, and I make for a great face. Also, I don't know what ZarZak can/would like to do. I don't know much about Druids...
Other Thoughts
DavidWL -
In the higher levels ...
- He'll keep up via the flexibility of chameleon/akashic - NoldorForce
- The fast growth of the utility of magic will mean that this grows faster tan normal. DavidWL - Theurge Charisma Monkey
- I wonder ... as levels get higher, will his build need beefing up? Maybe add some more LA on one side? Dhraksis
- Because of the uniquenss of his many tricks, I think he'll be good throughout. Surreal
- He'll power up amazingly as soon as he gets access to the Solar form (CL 17 Clerical casting! Full Solar goodness!). It will be a stretch for any of us to keep up ... ZarZak
^^- ZarZak - Celestine will access to Planetar form at lvl 14, Solar form at lvl 18. He'll also soon be able to access Titan form, and Efreeti form. This is besides all of the other forms he can take (a huge number thanks to planar shepherd).
Just a start ...
Best,
David
Surreal
I pretty much hit the high point of my "tricks" at mid level with Cabinet Trickster. The next few levels speed up my mind reading with Mindspy and introduces Master of the Unseen Hand (which I'm actually not too familiar with, but it seems like the right thing to use). If anything, my power curve slows down significantly from this point on. Grabbing leadership is an option which I'm still mulling over. Any suggestions for the later levels? I just threw Swordsage in there because ToB seems like the popular thing to use.
Noldor - Vintereth's power will increase as she rises in level. 12th level will be the biggest increase in power, considering the +2->+4 boost in Ability Boon, multiple Aptitude Foci, Permanency availability, and Polymorph Any Object (brachina have 12 HD). There's also the eventual fun of starting out with the divine focus and burning its spells out before swapping to combat, which will come at 14th level (aptitude focus 3/day). Plus, there's warshaper goodness and the collection of feats and ability increases from Evolved Human. Finally, the akashic abilities are all very useful: continued sneak attack, skill goodness, feats, and an eventual 7th-level SLA. If we go into epic levels, Vintereth will probably continue her chameleon//akashic progression. The former grants higher caster levels and more bonuses to existing stuff, while the latter eventually grants 9th-level SLAs and the ability to sneak attack practically anytime (useful with Staggering Strike).
DavidWL - Surreal, with the potential to read 4 minds at once and apply your "tricks" with a DC of 28+, that doesn't seem half bad. To power up more, take extraordinary concentration at higher levels letting you get 3 Full Attacks via Master of the Unseen Hand (1 from standard action, 1 from MotUH fast concentration, 1 from Extraordinary Concentration with a high enough check). Finally, perhaps Fil would let you apply a Rod of Chain to your Telekinesis (doesn't exist, but base it off of a rod of maximize), so you can "go nova" 3 times per day?
fil here 1-21
Looks like folks are gettig down to the nity gritty on their builds.I'll of course be looking to get a collection of stats to use... ac, hp, attack and damages, range on attacks, social skills, save dc's forms of perception for all characters under off guard, on guard, and buffed circumstances. over time, I'll ned to have folk's power scales towards now to 30th level... this can be over time, but I'd need to know now and next level abilities.
Things like prefered alternate forms, buff sequences, and tricks are good. Y'all are doig a great job keeping things rolling, and I look forward to dolling out xp at the start o the actual game.
I'll want to post a chart with everyone's power levels to monitor, so I can make sure I'm not tossin anything too weak or powerful at the right circumstances.
I also am roll-heavy in social circumstances, treating relavent conversations as CR's.. so having a face is nice, but more than one is good... those will be scaled accordingly as well.
I often have high and low successes and failures for important negotiations. so that is just more xp opportunities for you guys.
Bear in mind, you guys that can change forms will want to take into consideration what those stats will do to the rest of the team. if busting solar loose all the time keeps you in pace with the team, do it. if you are throwing the team out of whack, be conservative with your choices.
Again, I will match challenges to your statistics, so when I compile that table, if we are seeing blatant unbalance, we'll want to discuss how to cover those differences.
Until I started running games this way, we never broke down what we can do so specifically-- but with such liberal allowances on character construction and progression, it is extremely helpful. If you are used to doing this, then thanks for helping keep it organized! If this is new to you, then you'll be pleased at seeing how you and everyone will set the pace in various aspects of the game. Generally speaking, if one character is more than 15 above or below the average then it is out of whack. an average team with touch AC around 25 should be concerned if one character has a 40 or another only 10. (notice this example is touch ac... which sets the pace for all "to hits". the tank could have AC 55, but a touch AC of 20. he's easy mage bait... but if the rest of the team is touch ac 35, then he's a bit out of whack.)
spell flexibility is obviously a worrisome variable. knowing what you are capable of doing will help define what you should do for the party balance.
^^fil here... surreal, keep in mind that we are going ot be spending time in the spirit world as needed... sul is strong on the prime, but on the ethereal he's at risk. you can possess folks in the spirit world, but they can easily poke you in the eye while you try.
I anticipate spending decent chuncks of time both on and off the prime.. in fact, most combat will likely occur in the spirit world where demons angels, elementals and other spirits are in their strongest, true forms... generally, the mortal realm will be a place for economic, political, and social conflict... outright violece will often just cause trouble and strain on the various factions in power. Granted, this can flip as the plot demands.
so there ya go... consider the various dimensions (pun pun) of conflict.
I'll have to add a spirit world/elemental side and prime/outer plane side for sul, and the shadows' sakes.
^^- ZarZak - Fil, when you said power scales from now until 30th lvl, did you mean until 20th lvl or do you want epic progressions? If its the latter, I'm not quite sure how the epic bonus feat divying out will go (unless you just have 1 at 21, 24, 27, 30).
^^fil here 1-21.. don't worry about epic progression until we get to it. we only really need to know what will happen 1 or 2 levels ahead of time. There may only be one or two major conflicts per level, and expect each postsequence to be 1% of needed xp per level... so you guys could just bs for 100 posts and gain a level... I"ll post more on this under campaign rules real fast.
^^Noldor - How far into epic do you plan to go? I ask because AE simply doesn't have support for epic levels; the extra five levels beyond 20th is its version thereof.
^^fil here 1-21
I don't care. we will NOT be using epic spells. we'll simply use eldritch machines as per ECS instead. you'll have access to epic feats every three levels as per standard epic rules, you just can't play an "epic akashic" since it lacks rules.. just pick something new to start. we'll worry about that when we get there. Without epic spells, epic play is very viable.
^^Noldor - I can (and probably will!) go 25 levels into akashic without skipping a beat...I was instead wondering if/how far we'd go beyond that.
^^fil here 1-21 without "epic spells", non- casters have a chance of actually catching up to casters in power.. granted it will likely come through magic gear and artifacts (built a bow that cast "flaming arrow" spells with each shot... 4 maximixed admixtured empowered flaming arrow spells per round is respectable for an archer)
Also, even a rogue can construct an eldritch machine to do the impossible. I just won't give you any set rules.. you'll have to research them the hard way... plenty of adventure to be had there!
^^DavidWL - addressing some of your points Fil
- When you want stats from each of us, just create a "Form" listing what you want on some page, and we can each Fil it out. (I couldn't help myself)
- Regardling spell flexibility - while a key "trick" in my build is spell flexibility, I'm completely fine with starting with fewer recalled spells (Like a Spirit Shaman instead of a Wizard) - while I'd still be very flexible, my "drop of the hat" flexibility would be a little less. I'll start working on a spell list, so that you can see what kinds of spells I'd like to select.
- In my opinion, I don't think Surreal is terribly vulnerable even on the Spirit World ... he still has good AC, great saves, rejuvenation, amazing HP. All he really loses is the incorporality and the possession - it's a lot to lose, but he still has a lot of defensive ability left over.
- FYI: there are rules for an Akashic through level 25 ... just not past that.
- A random thought: If we gain 1% exp per post, and post twice per day (very aggressive), that's 7 levels a year, or 3 years to go from 10th level to 30th level.
Surreal Whoa waitasec... did Fil just say I can possess folks in the spirit realm? I never even considered that. If we can collaborate on a way to knock down an angel/demon's Will save, I'll have a really juicy body to ride around in. As for being vulnerable in the spirit realm, I forgot that I do have my warshaper abilities, so at least I'll be armed and whatnot. I still need to figure out how I'm going to equip myself though (I misread how some of my gold allotment worked; so I need to refigure stuff out; at the moment I've only spent maybe 20k).
^^fil here 1-22
not just anyone, surreal.
what you can possess anywhere:
humanoids
beasts
magic beasts
monstrous humanoids
plants
oozes
costructs (any, drop the warforged caveat)
objects
aberrations
animals
what you can't possess anywhere:
spirits-- which comprise the follwoing:
undead
elementals
fey
outsiders
these creatures are typically "soulless"... their physical bodies are their spirits.
the exception to this rule-- anything capable of possessing can be possessed- if it has a physical body to possess. ghosts and shades have no physical body.. they can't be possessed. But a marilith demon could be possessed if it itself is capable of possessing. things that can possess are capable of abndoning it's body to control another. this leaves them open to possession themselves. (ironic)
so you can try to possess them if you wish, but it's a crap shoot. You can use magics and what not to identify who can possess, and stalk them speciically. Another wonderful adventure to pursue. A strong outsider will likely be defended if leaving its body to go off. Bear in mind, good forces channel... which akes the physical body with it. only the evil types will possess. so you will only have access to the evil.
^^Noldor - @DavidWL - Indeed, I'll be taking all 25 levels of akashic if possible (as mentioned above). There's too much goodness to not take the levels, such as uber-blindsight, 9th-level SLAs, and the ability to gain ANY non-epic class feature (excepting spellcasting) in the manner of the chameleon's bonus feat. On the other side, I'll be heading into Spelldancer ASAP (at 22nd level, right after taking a custom epic feat in the epic chamelon progression) and will be able to Persistify a lot of stuff at juicy-high CLs.
| DavidWL - Surreal, with the potential to read 4 minds at once and apply your "tricks" with a DC of 28+, that doesn't seem half bad. To power up more, take extraordinary concentration at higher levels letting you get 3 Full Attacks via Master of the Unseen Hand (1 from standard action, 1 from MotUH fast concentration, 1 from Extraordinary Concentration with a high enough check). Finally, perhaps Fil would let you apply a Rod of Chain to your Telekinesis (doesn't exist, but base it off of a rod of maximize), so you can "go nova" 3 times per day? |
^^Surreal Whoa, totally missed this earlier. I'm going to have to read up on the MotUH on the boards as I don't fully understand all the mechanics behind it yet. How exactly does the "nova" work in this case?
^^fil here. a full attack still uses a full attack actio in the round... it isn't sped up. this si a specific modification of the MotUH. If you had a way to actually cast Telekinesis as well, then yes, you could have an sla and spell active simultaneously, but again, sustained force or maintaining concentration are the only 2 things that are affected by move actions... atacks of all sorts require at least a standard action, if not a full round attack.
quicken sla would allow for 2 actions per round, but this is a very high level spell that is not accessible until nearly epic levels.
sorry to be a party crasher. I don't see this going nova.
Now, a beholdermage with multiple telekinesis eyes could easily go nova with MotUH. I've played on in the past, and they are ripping fun.
^^^DavidWL - Fil, RAW, I think I disagree with you. The text of the MotUH refers to the "Combat Manuever" or "Violent Thrust" abilities of TK, which only requires concentration (as is the case with all TK abilities). This was the root of the TK builds on the optimizion boards. However, even without that, Surreal could potentially go for a "Chain Spell Like Ability" feat which would presumably be available at 16th level (assuming you rule it ok for a SU ability).
Relavent Thread:
As always, as DM you can veto, but I don't think there is a RAW reason to veto.
Best,
David (who is thinking to himself, "boy it's a stupid thing to argue with the DM", but posts anyway :)
P.S. Extraordinary Concentration, while wonderful, unforetunately has the phrase, "This feat does not give you the ability to maintain concentration on more than 1 spell at a time". My bad, that.
P.P.S. I just realized why you (Fil) were saying what you were saying. In the text of the "Sustained Concentration" ability of the MotUH, it says, "It still takes a standard action to use combat manuever or violent thrust versions of the ability". Let me add that the text is talking not about a time cost to use the manuever, but a time cost to *concentrate* on the manuever. So, if you have ways that let you concentrate multiple times, that should still apply.
^^fil here.
good call, david. the standard action is accurate, but yes, if he can manage to maintain multiple tk's simultaneously, the standard action would apply to all tk's active as a swarm.
SU abilities are not modified by metamagic, tho.... you could take a feat to "drop" tk from su to sla, eventually givin you access to chain tk through some creative dm'ing, followig the quicken sla format already in rint. strictly surreal's choice, which may be viable into epic levels to maintain power with the casters.
Hrmmm...epic
celestie = full casting and better alternate forms
tanner = full casting and better eldritch master
sul = posession and Master of the unseen NOVA Hand
vintereth = 25 of akashic, and epic chameleon opens the door to a ton of prc's to pursue...
5th wheel?
from what I see so far, since epic spells are open to anyone via eldritch machinery, this team (5th wheel unaccounted) is going to be looking pretty good far into epic growth. since noen fo you are really "mundane" by nature, meaning not straight melee fighter int 3 types, I don't see a dramatic power curve occurring.
You'll eventually want to migrate to the beyond, otherwise your favorite prime city will become a smoking crater during a grudge attack, but such is the price of power. EVerything here is onion layers, and I believe in ripples. So as you impact one aspect of te game, other organizations and powers compensate, and the next tier becomes interested as the ripples get bigger. so you will eentually be drawing the attentio of obviously, epic level baddies from beyond.
DavidWL - Hmm. In Epic, I'm sure I'll find something to continue the power scale (as Eldritch Master definitely doesn't do it, after I've already gotten access to Arcane, Cleric, Psion, and Bard spells). Similarly, I've gotten what I want from Incantrix at that point. Perhaps something like Hathran for the circle magic and more flexible casting. I don't know about the other side.
Also, I'd actually prefer that there not be Epic Spells. Just too broken for my taste. That said, perhaps we could create custom spells for 10th, 11th, etc. spell slots? Like Epic spells, but balanced solely by DM and party judgement, and not by the broken rules in the book.
lonewolf - As a late addition to the team, Im trying to catch up with everyone else. I believe that at level 10 Valeas is pretty effective with what he does, but Im not sure if he is gonna stay viable in higher and epic levels compared to the spellcasters. Any ideas for further improve him are welcome.
^^fil here
I think you are very wise to be concerned with this, Lonewolf.
Honestly, what makes this character so cool is his history and faction. Great job.
but otherwise he's just a melee monkey, and he's already esentially rached his peak efficiency.
I mean, yer gonna get extra attacks, and yer gonna do more dmage, but not at the escalated rate of the blasters.
I'm also considering your backgrond story...valeas is the decendant of a not so famous military leader who your character would ultimately like to rise in prestige, I'm sure. Your character is not buit to be a leader o any kind. crap charisma, no skills, and a self description of "quiet guy, keps to himself". this is very contradictory to the forefather, uniting mishmash ragtag soldiers into a powerful unit that ultimately got bested by bad tactics. Helluva guy, needed some good advisors.
Your character in his current form, will nevr rise above, or even TO your legacy. Maybe your character got depressed that he was crushed so early on in his carreer. He needs to have one of those "bounce back" attitudes to beat this thing, and make folks think Valeas of old had the right idea. Look at his grandkid!
Of course, you can just decide to ditch that calling... but you
ARE using his horse.
How does this keep you competitve? well, although others are using leadership, its for the cohort. You, on the otherhand, cna build true followrs. get an organization running as an independant merc squad, a merchant house rivaling current order, whatever you want. You can have people with skills. Now, you can't exceed your gold value for personal use, but you can certainly be the figurehead of a massive self-propogating machine.
Bill has volunteered to npc organizations... it could be yours. Use the cohort to bump yer smart horse in a few levels, and start working on a multidimensional regime that will shock the elves of old.
If this campaign ever gets to a point where a stand is going to be made agaist a second wave of daelkyr, I'm sure valeas would want the history books remembering him, not some other guy.
If you really DON'T want to rise into a leadership role, then there are some viable melee options to keep you competitve in higher levels.
again, make something of that horse as a cohort. we'l figure it out later.
dervish was a good call, but the dhraksis build was supremely powerful as a dervish comparatively, plus he would eventually be doing str damage with all his attacks-- TAHT was a debuffing whirlwind of pain.
There isalso hyperenhancing your weaponry, eldritch machinatios can give you an edge to keep up with the team
you can eventually get into incarnum, or psionics-- since "epic spells" are not a true concern, the casers are gonna max out with things like twinned maximized empowered disintegrates, or whatever. They are limited to essentially to one action and a swift action with move. melee types with a solid bab progression really have more actions. swift, move, and full attack (4-10 actions, depending on builds) its just an issue of keeping those iterative attacks effective in scale to the casters.
While they have versatility and options, you will be limited to blasting- so you need to be the best blaster or field controller by a long shot. You are the only dedicated melee damager.
If you feel like your character just got beat up, good. When people are uncomfortable they make decisions. what you have currently is fantastic for where he has been. Since you know you need to worry about where he's headed, time to consider your options.
welcome to the team!
lonewolf - I dont really like the leadership idea. Valeas charisma is crappy and I also like the idea that no matter how good a fighter Valeas becomes, he will never be able to match his ancestors leadership abilities, from a roleplaying perspective. I rather try to continue to do what he does now, but improve it as good as possible.
One option Im considering is changing the build to also include Multipouncing. That would need a few tricks and would probably weaken the character for lvl10(no shadowpouncing yet), but overall Im not really sure if that is really worth the costs. Other Ideas I have include the exchange of the scout levels with Warmind, Occoult Slayer, Divine Crusader or something else, but Im not really sure about that. Any input in that direction would be appreciated.
DavidWL - lonewolf ... I tend to think that the ToB material is great, and you're not far from qualifying for Master of Nine. Also, the right templates on one side of the build could also help. (Mineral Warrior is classic, perhaps Shadow or Celestial, ... ?). You could also add a few feats with the Evolved human, which would help feed an abusive feat chain. Just some thoughts.
^^Noldor - Er, how does he manage to meet the prerequisite of being, well, human? :) (I'd planned on taking Racial Emulation for that very reason.)
^^lonewolf - With Feral and Lolth touched, I think I already used some of the more powerful templates, and if I take any more I couldnt have bought them of yet, so I think I will decline that. Master of Nine might be an option although the requirements are a bit steep. yeah and like Noldor said: not beeing human kinda ruins the Evolved Human idea. ;)
Surreal Per request by Fil, I will be reserving my Unholy Toughness feat until epic levels. This will bring my hp down to a more manageable 71 and help balance out the party a bit. I don't have too much time to fiddle with all the build pages, just shift all my existing feats up a slot, and 12 is still open (possibly leadership). Will fix later when I have a moment.
^^fil here 2-6
and much appreciation, surreal. You are going to have one hella legion of undead at your disposal if you choose in the epic builds.
I am still concerned about Valeas. We may just have to go with ultra powerful magic gear builds... like a trigger item sword that releases concussion with each successful strike... like a full round chanelled spell ability, or something. I'm sure I can come up with some clever rituals for valeas to endure later on to give him some sweet skillz.... maybe a permanized 3.0 haste effect or something? that would be awfully nice. especially if you do decide to pursue multipouncing eventually...
perhaps you could explore manifesting the horse as a real critter summoned from the sword, and pursue shadow marauder.... that would get you multipounce and a pocketable mount-- flying spirit horse that can cross the spirit world barrier at will? that would be awfully handy too.
I think yer build is strong for now. Yer gonna have a lot of wealth down the road to blow. All these options can be bought in one manner or another.
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